Three arrested for allegedly killing cats
By ANGELA BRANDT - Independent Record - 09/05/08
Authorities have arrested three Helena men for allegedly torturing and killing about 20 cats, including three that were burned alive.
Brandon Wayne Hartford, 26, Andrew Joseph Welch, 20, and Kyle K. Hallowell, 19, each faces a felony charge of aggravated animal cruelty for “burning, stabbing, beating, slaughtering and torturing” the cats, which they hunted in several locations in Helena, East Helena and the Helena Valley, according to documents filed Thursday in Justice Court.
Hartford and Welch, who are both being held in lieu of a $25,000 bond, were taken into custody Wednesday.
Hallowell was arrested Thursday morning and his bond will be set today.
According to Lewis and Clark County detectives Larry Platts and Cory Olson, who investigated the killings along with Det. Dennis Nyland, the three men drove around neighborhoods during the night, stalking and hunting stray and pet cats.
The men told investigators that they had killed between 16 and 24 cats. Investigators said there is no evidence that could identify where the animals came from.
When they located a cat, the men would lure the animal into their car and take it to one of several locations, which included construction sites, wooded areas and the house on the 2800 block of Winslow Avenue where the men have been living.
“These are inhumane acts of cruelty,” Sheriff Leo Dutton said. “It shocks the conscience.”
The detectives said the men have been killing the animals for at least the past two months.
The alleged crimes apparently began with the men’s joint dislike of cats, Platts said. Hartford allegedly started the spree by beating to death a cat that scratched him when he picked it up, Olson said.
The investigation of the men stemmed from witness statements during the investigation of an unrelated report of disorderly conduct earlier in the week, Dutton said.
Officials declined to give more information about that incident because it is still under investigation.
“I am shocked how someone can treat an animal with no way of protecting itself this way and get some gratification from it,” Dutton added.
In addition to the cruelty charges, Hartford and Welch both face a felony charge of tampering with or fabricating physical evidence for removing evidence from the crime scene on Winslow Avenue and using bleach in an attempt to clean up blood stains.
Hallowell also was arrested on a misdemeanor charge of obstructing a peace officer.
Reporter Angela Brandt: 447-4078 or angela.brandt@helenair.com
Brandon Wayne Hartford, 26, Andrew Joseph Welch, 20, and Kyle K. Hallowell, 19, each faces a felony charge of aggravated animal cruelty for “burning, stabbing, beating, slaughtering and torturing” the cats, which they hunted in several locations in Helena, East Helena and the Helena Valley, according to documents filed Thursday in Justice Court.
Hartford and Welch, who are both being held in lieu of a $25,000 bond, were taken into custody Wednesday.
Hallowell was arrested Thursday morning and his bond will be set today.
According to Lewis and Clark County detectives Larry Platts and Cory Olson, who investigated the killings along with Det. Dennis Nyland, the three men drove around neighborhoods during the night, stalking and hunting stray and pet cats.
The men told investigators that they had killed between 16 and 24 cats. Investigators said there is no evidence that could identify where the animals came from.
When they located a cat, the men would lure the animal into their car and take it to one of several locations, which included construction sites, wooded areas and the house on the 2800 block of Winslow Avenue where the men have been living.
“These are inhumane acts of cruelty,” Sheriff Leo Dutton said. “It shocks the conscience.”
The detectives said the men have been killing the animals for at least the past two months.
The alleged crimes apparently began with the men’s joint dislike of cats, Platts said. Hartford allegedly started the spree by beating to death a cat that scratched him when he picked it up, Olson said.
The investigation of the men stemmed from witness statements during the investigation of an unrelated report of disorderly conduct earlier in the week, Dutton said.
Officials declined to give more information about that incident because it is still under investigation.
“I am shocked how someone can treat an animal with no way of protecting itself this way and get some gratification from it,” Dutton added.
In addition to the cruelty charges, Hartford and Welch both face a felony charge of tampering with or fabricating physical evidence for removing evidence from the crime scene on Winslow Avenue and using bleach in an attempt to clean up blood stains.
Hallowell also was arrested on a misdemeanor charge of obstructing a peace officer.
Reporter Angela Brandt: 447-4078 or angela.brandt@helenair.com
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Reader Comments:
ginger wrote on Sep 17, 2008 3:29 PM:
" angelwatching
It is an unspoken rule that child abuse is wrong, terrible, and is absolutely not condoned by the community. Unfortunatley, it does need to be said that animals are feeling beings and deserve to be kept safe also. "
It is an unspoken rule that child abuse is wrong, terrible, and is absolutely not condoned by the community. Unfortunatley, it does need to be said that animals are feeling beings and deserve to be kept safe also. "
montanadude wrote on Sep 17, 2008 8:52 AM:
" angelwatching28-
Just because this one story generates more comments on a forum board than the other is no indication that the community thinks this crime is more heinous than then next. It's a serious stretch by anyone to make that conclusion and it really has no merit.
And as you are aware, there's an avalance affect; once a story hits the most commented page, a lot of people suddenly feel the need to weigh in, not unlike yourself. Probably because they know alot of people will read their (anonymous) comments or maybe to inject a new topic into the thread. (e.g. abortion issue has nothing to do with the story).
But it certainly doesn't mean folks here value pets more than kids, and one would think that would be obvious. "
Just because this one story generates more comments on a forum board than the other is no indication that the community thinks this crime is more heinous than then next. It's a serious stretch by anyone to make that conclusion and it really has no merit.
And as you are aware, there's an avalance affect; once a story hits the most commented page, a lot of people suddenly feel the need to weigh in, not unlike yourself. Probably because they know alot of people will read their (anonymous) comments or maybe to inject a new topic into the thread. (e.g. abortion issue has nothing to do with the story).
But it certainly doesn't mean folks here value pets more than kids, and one would think that would be obvious. "
JK03 wrote on Sep 17, 2008 7:20 AM:
" Clearly you arenot listening to the amount of public outcry over "animals" i have never seen any one take up arms when children are molested just like angel watching has written i`m not saying that they wouldn`t move to children but if they did we wouldn`t be talking here because there wouldn`t be the public outcry there has been over these cute cuddly kittens check out the other articles people are talking bout sensitivity work shops to teach children that animals have felings to my concerns come from a broader view of this subject and our society people lose all logic when animals are involved but seldom bat an eye when the head lines read child molestation or abuse "
nmraptor1 wrote on Sep 16, 2008 5:58 PM:
" I belivie that you ali remember that Helena could be called "The West Learning Center". I've got an Idea. "Helena, Home of The Vigalinties; Past!, Present!!, Future???" "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 16, 2008 3:46 PM:
" JK03, there have been several people who have stated the reason for their concerns here. Clearly you are not listening to what the basis of their worry is. They are worried that it will go from just cats to humans which I am sure includes children. "
angelwatching28 wrote on Sep 16, 2008 2:01 PM:
" In response to MtBecky, I find what you say and write more interesting. I see that toward the end of your blog, when you write,"Away from out pets and our kids!!" You place pets before kids. Just like I wrote, the community is more angry by animal cruelty then by child sexual predators. Example,Aikido instructor back in jail after contacting victim, By ANGELA BRANDT - Independent Record - 07/09/08 only received two comments, not 20 or 90 like in this case. I also believe this person is still waiting to be tried and or sentenced. I just made note that a case like this gets more public outcry and will more then likely get the sentence of the people then crimes against children.
Miss.Angelwatching "
Miss.Angelwatching "
JK03 wrote on Sep 16, 2008 8:58 AM:
" Well MTBecky i agree that what you said is true torturing an animal is wrong these guys should get the maximum penalty but i think what angel watching is saying and i agree with her to people become more angered when animals are involved than they do if childeren were involved as if they valued the lives of these cats more than the lives of a child (i`m sure if you asked them they would deny this but actions speak louder than words) next time there is a child abuse case there should be mobs at the court house demanding maximum penalties and huge amounts of publi coutcry. . don`t get me wrong this is disgusting and the men should be proecuted to the fullest no one should treat an animal without "respect" but after all they were just cats "
MtBecky wrote on Sep 15, 2008 10:50 PM:
" Well Angelwatching28, correct me if I am wrong, but is there a case of child abuse going on now? No. Everyone does get upset, but Men who DO abuse children DO get tough sentences!! Then they have to watch their backs constantly in prison, because even other prisoners hate them!! Animal abusers rarely get much time and these animal abusers, abused many peoples pets!! In horrible, horrible ways! We don't want anymore wrist slapping....We want them to pay!!
And it's been proven time and again that those that abuse animals, DO go on to abuse people, including children!
Imagine if Jeffrey Dalmer (many have brought him up and he is an excellant example) what if he had gotten caught when he was abusing animals and was put away! He wouldn't have gone on to kill all the young men he did! That's why we want these monsters put away for a very long time. Out of our community!! Away from out pets and our kids!! They are monsters. Plain and simple. You think this is "quite interesting"? I think it's heartbreaking and sick and yes, I AM outraged! "
And it's been proven time and again that those that abuse animals, DO go on to abuse people, including children!
Imagine if Jeffrey Dalmer (many have brought him up and he is an excellant example) what if he had gotten caught when he was abusing animals and was put away! He wouldn't have gone on to kill all the young men he did! That's why we want these monsters put away for a very long time. Out of our community!! Away from out pets and our kids!! They are monsters. Plain and simple. You think this is "quite interesting"? I think it's heartbreaking and sick and yes, I AM outraged! "
angelwatching28 wrote on Sep 15, 2008 5:14 PM:
" This quite interesting. The community is outraged by such acts, the senseless killing of animals and bob_mt wants the community to go to the court house to show their anger and the community wants the maximum punishment imposed. The part that is interesting, where is the public outcry when a child get molested? How come the community does not rally at the court house and scream for the maximum punishment to be imposed? Don't get me wrong, I think this crime needs to be addressed, but it is sad to see that animal cruelty outrage the community more then crimes against children.
Miss.Angelwatching "
Miss.Angelwatching "
jdmontana wrote on Sep 15, 2008 2:12 PM:
" Please take note of the judge and prosecutor assigned to this case. I know both gentlemen personally, and be assured that they will carry out justice to the fullest extent. In the event that these three men are convicted on all counts, (and I am wholly positive that they will be), both court officers will make certain each receive the maximum penalty under law. I suspect that L&C County will have the full support and resources of both the HSUS Washington office and ASPCA New York office to assist them.
I also have faith in the corrections system. I am certain that once these men are convicted, sentenced, and transferred out of Helena, they will be enjoying a relaxing stay at a wonderful country resort, located a mere 5 miles outside of scenic Deer Lodge, Montana, where they will never again see another summer day. Prison populations tend to have a zero tolerance policy in cases such as this.
The probably 40 - 48 year sentences will most likely be meaningless... it's amazing how long it can take for MSP security to change shifts sometimes. "
I also have faith in the corrections system. I am certain that once these men are convicted, sentenced, and transferred out of Helena, they will be enjoying a relaxing stay at a wonderful country resort, located a mere 5 miles outside of scenic Deer Lodge, Montana, where they will never again see another summer day. Prison populations tend to have a zero tolerance policy in cases such as this.
The probably 40 - 48 year sentences will most likely be meaningless... it's amazing how long it can take for MSP security to change shifts sometimes. "
jnbinmt wrote on Sep 15, 2008 11:41 AM:
" wOw reading all of these comments is sad. Look at our community we are all discusted sad hurt enraged. And it is causing us to come up with horrible things to do to them. Here on earth they will eventually get whats comming to them, To; the mothers and fathers of these young discusting men, this may or may not be your fault , no matter how a person is raised we all have the choice of being who were gonna be.Anyone check out what JEFFERY DALMER did before his sick human slaughters? We need to take this seriously and the parents need to continue to love and support them reasonably, for them to get help they need theyr parental units in their corner.
Sadly when the paper makes a big deal then so does our town, why are we not enraged when a careless mother or a rape ends in pregnancy and the baby is painfully aborted. Innocent lives are taken all the time and we only act when a big deal is made of it, these boys need to be seriously punished and so do alot of people. How many of you have committed a "murder" and have gotten away with it, but yet you will be the first to judge. We live in a sick world and need to deal with it. All living things were meant to pass away naturally. And when you cause an untimley death i feel that you too should also have one. "
Sadly when the paper makes a big deal then so does our town, why are we not enraged when a careless mother or a rape ends in pregnancy and the baby is painfully aborted. Innocent lives are taken all the time and we only act when a big deal is made of it, these boys need to be seriously punished and so do alot of people. How many of you have committed a "murder" and have gotten away with it, but yet you will be the first to judge. We live in a sick world and need to deal with it. All living things were meant to pass away naturally. And when you cause an untimley death i feel that you too should also have one. "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 14, 2008 7:47 PM:
" naturalblonde, the fact that I took psych 101 led me to believe these men may turn to out to be serial killers, not some statement by an officer on TV. And while the stories of Manywhitehorses and Duncan are equally sad and disturbing, they did not happen in the same town I live in. The proximity bothers me, as it should every other member of this community. "
montanablue wrote on Sep 14, 2008 6:27 PM:
" ToCwelch and finished. I know it is probably human and only natural to defend our families when they do wrong. As a family we can twist our thoughts and our minds into believing that so and so did no wrong, or what they did was realy not that huge of a matter ! I know you love your son, brother.. and want to help him so he is not ridiculed by society and hoping he doesn't go to prison for this. I don't blame you for this. And for those who want to bring up abortion or whattever, the topic is, It isn't about that. It is about
the slayings of these little defenseless cats. This is their time and not anti abortion rights. These creatures were put here on this earth for many purposes. For companionship, friends, as a family member, to help those who are in need, they help us hunt, they help us track, on and on the list goes. But being a domestic animal these companions depend upon us humans to feed, take care of them when they are in danger, giver them water, love them, play with them, and most of all they are forgiving. They intend no harm to us and offer us their upmost trust and friendship. That is why they came to these ugly human beings with confidence, fearless, not even an inkling of fear in their minds. It is because God gave us these creatures for us to love and take care of that they are our friends. So, if you feel that no injustice has done than you are way beyond help yourself. I don't spill these words with hate or disdain for your son. I say these words on behalf of my animal friends and for all of the loved filled devotion they constantly offer me.
Your son and his buddies did this with deliberate thinking. This was not some random driveby. I want to say again that these kitties were and are defenseless except for their claws and ability to bite or run away. But for God Sakes! What sort of human tortures or sets fire to a animal or otherwise? I have to say I have no mercy on these fellows. I don't want to hear how they hate cats or how they had some injustice done to them somewhere along the line.. We've all had hard times and we do our best to overcome them. And yes, I hope and pray noone I know never ever does something so curel and mean as your son and his friends have done. It simply bewilders my mind anymore why on earth huamns do the things they do. Maybe with a little thoughtfulness and more love, more family values and togetherness, we may be more inclined to do less harm to others around us..You think so? As for now, No, I am not forgiving of your son for his actions he decided to take against these defenseless kitties. He has a brain, and he could have just said no! "
the slayings of these little defenseless cats. This is their time and not anti abortion rights. These creatures were put here on this earth for many purposes. For companionship, friends, as a family member, to help those who are in need, they help us hunt, they help us track, on and on the list goes. But being a domestic animal these companions depend upon us humans to feed, take care of them when they are in danger, giver them water, love them, play with them, and most of all they are forgiving. They intend no harm to us and offer us their upmost trust and friendship. That is why they came to these ugly human beings with confidence, fearless, not even an inkling of fear in their minds. It is because God gave us these creatures for us to love and take care of that they are our friends. So, if you feel that no injustice has done than you are way beyond help yourself. I don't spill these words with hate or disdain for your son. I say these words on behalf of my animal friends and for all of the loved filled devotion they constantly offer me.
Your son and his buddies did this with deliberate thinking. This was not some random driveby. I want to say again that these kitties were and are defenseless except for their claws and ability to bite or run away. But for God Sakes! What sort of human tortures or sets fire to a animal or otherwise? I have to say I have no mercy on these fellows. I don't want to hear how they hate cats or how they had some injustice done to them somewhere along the line.. We've all had hard times and we do our best to overcome them. And yes, I hope and pray noone I know never ever does something so curel and mean as your son and his friends have done. It simply bewilders my mind anymore why on earth huamns do the things they do. Maybe with a little thoughtfulness and more love, more family values and togetherness, we may be more inclined to do less harm to others around us..You think so? As for now, No, I am not forgiving of your son for his actions he decided to take against these defenseless kitties. He has a brain, and he could have just said no! "
bob_mt wrote on Sep 14, 2008 5:38 PM:
" EVERYBODY in this community who wants to maintain our community needs to call the court house Monday morning and find the initial court date scheduled for this week and make time to attend all the proceedings. Take the time to show your face to our public officials and these three in court. We need to start taking a very strong public stand in our court rooms against crime and group crimes. If we do not show ourselves to oppose crime against our neighbors then our neighbors have to reason to oppose crime against us and then we are no longer a community. "
Natasha wrote on Sep 14, 2008 1:44 PM:
" http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/men-torture-kill-cats-in-helena-montana
Please sign the peition and give the cats a voice! Their lives were viciously taken.
I think the mothers should have all their other children evaluated just in case. "
Please sign the peition and give the cats a voice! Their lives were viciously taken.
I think the mothers should have all their other children evaluated just in case. "
flowers4u wrote on Sep 14, 2008 12:13 PM:
" 1 year in jail??? Are you kidding me? What these 3 gentlemen (and I use the word gentlemen loosley) did was no less if not more cruel, than what Mr. Vick did with his dogs. And he is currently serving a multiple year FEDERAL PRISON term. Send 'em away..... far far away, for a long long time. "
swiftv wrote on Sep 13, 2008 9:02 AM:
" cwelch: What happened exactly is that these bullies confessed to: killing. You are only enabling them by making excuses and minimizing the horror of their acts, including your son. It's time for tough love, mom. They need to get the maximum sentence, 1 year in jail with no plea bargains. If you want to save your son, you will be in the forefront demanding this sentence. They don't need treatment instead of the sentence. They need the sentence, then treatment.
Somebody forgot to teach them boundaries and personal responsibility. Now they have to learn both at public expense. "
Somebody forgot to teach them boundaries and personal responsibility. Now they have to learn both at public expense. "
ginger wrote on Sep 12, 2008 6:37 PM:
" naturalblonde196 Just because people are outraged about this situation does not take away their outrage for another situation. We can be concerned about more than one issue at a time. It is just that these admitted killers are more likely to get off easy because they killed animals and not humans. "
ilovemt wrote on Sep 12, 2008 6:10 PM:
" I think the family should go onto the anti cruelty websites and watch the videos of the cats on fire and suffering and look at pictures of bodies of tourtured cats. I think you should SEE what they did and hear the cats meowing and hallering in pain making noises that will haunt your dreams. I looked into it. I think the families should also read the owners account of finding their cats dead, half of their cat, having to end their cats suffering because the tourture was too severe. I can't imagine doing this to anything. "
DAKOTA_RT wrote on Sep 12, 2008 3:27 PM:
" No one is saying that your children are going to become serial killers because they resorted to killing cats for pleasure. However, some psychological evaluations should be taken. Extensive background information on family history of mental disorders, has any member of the family been sexually abused. There can be multiple reasons these individuals did the acts that make no sense to healthy people. People don't go out on vendettas killing cats because they got scratched. Sure it may make you mad but enrage you into a complete mission to hunt and torture cats. There ambition to seek and destroy very well could be a soothing act, an act that makes them feel good inside. That's not normal and eventually that feeling won't be enough...then what...citizens are concerned and there is nothing wrong with trying to get to the bottom of this by seeing a professional psychologist. It's too bad they couldn't get help before this such tragedy took place. "
naturalblonde196 wrote on Sep 12, 2008 12:59 PM:
" To itellithowitis2.....How do you know she will get punished? maybe she will be found insane and get out after a few years in a state hospital. Happens all the time. "
ilovemt wrote on Sep 12, 2008 12:55 PM:
" naturalblonde196: I hope you look into the rest of your family for any warning signs. "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 12, 2008 12:48 PM:
" naturalblonde196:
I read a book by an FBI profiler. In particluar those that let others have a hold of them and control them are vulnerable to doing more and more extreme things to impress the individual that has a hold them them. People know that the other people out there that committed murders and are meth addicts actually get sentanced appropriately. It is not just a TV thing about cat killers eventually turing to hurting people. Crimially Justic professional and pyscaitrists will all attest to the seriousness of the act. There are several accounts of group acts that stem from a group mentality. Karl Jung -- read about his work..groups are dangerous. Just because one committs and act because someone else is in charge doesn't make them any less accountalbe. By your logic, I should be able to kill your dog or cat and get off just because any older guy had control of me. I'd never do this, I'd choose to go to the police and turn the guy in and if my family was soooo supportive of me as you guys are then I should be albe to go to my family and say, I'm scared this guy is controlling my life. I see too many excuses. I hope they all get the maxium sentences. "
I read a book by an FBI profiler. In particluar those that let others have a hold of them and control them are vulnerable to doing more and more extreme things to impress the individual that has a hold them them. People know that the other people out there that committed murders and are meth addicts actually get sentanced appropriately. It is not just a TV thing about cat killers eventually turing to hurting people. Crimially Justic professional and pyscaitrists will all attest to the seriousness of the act. There are several accounts of group acts that stem from a group mentality. Karl Jung -- read about his work..groups are dangerous. Just because one committs and act because someone else is in charge doesn't make them any less accountalbe. By your logic, I should be able to kill your dog or cat and get off just because any older guy had control of me. I'd never do this, I'd choose to go to the police and turn the guy in and if my family was soooo supportive of me as you guys are then I should be albe to go to my family and say, I'm scared this guy is controlling my life. I see too many excuses. I hope they all get the maxium sentences. "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 12, 2008 9:37 AM:
" naturalblonde196: I know the trunk women will get her punishment and I know that is for sure because of how the law is- however, we all fear that these boys will be loose on the streets way too soon and they'll hurt or kill a loved one of ours... I don't want my child to feel the pain those cats felt "
naturalblonde196 wrote on Sep 12, 2008 9:35 AM:
" Hmmmmmmmmmm. Again no one addresses the fact that cats are getting this much attention but the 2 year old autistic boy is not. Sad thing for our society. Before you crucify these guys how about we all take alook in our own families and d a little judging. I bet every one of you have someone you are not proud of or has done something bad. This serial killer stuff would not have been addressed if the police officer on TV had not said those words. How come meth addicts that kill people to get meth and people that sell drugs to children or any of a half a dozen other things people call for treatment inculding the jail time but not with this? And by the way we don't know the whole story do we?????????? I happen to know that there is a lot of stuff going to come out about the older man and his hold on these younger boys. So, take a minute to stop judging and find out the real story. "
ilovemt wrote on Sep 11, 2008 6:46 PM:
" I find it extremely disturbing the families aren't considering this a big problem. Every Serial killer and killers that worked in groups started with animals. I remember watching a show about a group people in a documentary called the vampire killings, they started with cats and then turn to people. Wayyy to many stories out there about people starting with cats and moving on to people. A kid I grew up with in billings killed a cat and now he's in jail in Idaho for a murder. The fact is the family HAS to realize that their kids are reallly messed up in the head. My fear is that they'll get a slap on the wrist and 10 years from now I'll get a call that my daughter was kidnapped raped and tourtered to death by one of them "
MtBecky wrote on Sep 11, 2008 6:35 PM:
" These men are derranged idividuals. They didn't jus "screw up" finished, they took innocent, trusting, furry family members and tortured them and enjoyed what they did!! They deserve to rot in He--!!!! I'm sorry for what your family members are going through, but it was your brother who caused your pain. These people that have lost their cats did nothing and neither did their cats to have gone through such horror!! I'm outraged and will do anything I can to see to it that these heartless, excuses for men are made to pay dearly. I hope they go to prison for a good loooong time!!! Nothing will compare to the pain they have inflicted on the cats and their owners!
If anyone wants to sign the online petitiont urging the Judge and attorney to give them the maximum penalty allowed, and make comments please go to:
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/men-torture-kill-cats-in-helena-montana "
If anyone wants to sign the online petitiont urging the Judge and attorney to give them the maximum penalty allowed, and make comments please go to:
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/men-torture-kill-cats-in-helena-montana "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 11, 2008 5:17 PM:
" Finished: my father, who works in law enforcement, told me long ago that if I ever messed up I would indeed be punished to the fullest extent of the law. And I think any good parent would do the same if their child ran into similar circumstances. That never means a family member should stop loving them though or even feel hatred towards them. Hatred is not an answer here by anyone. How sad that so many members of your family seem consumed by it though. "
freetime wrote on Sep 11, 2008 5:04 PM:
" No offense to finished but you are not the only one with a family member who has been in trouble with the law!
I have one cousin who has serious mental problems who threaten the president more than once and his mom had to get a restraining order against him because he would threaten to kill her more than once!
My dad would come home drunk and slap my mom around! He even would threaten to take our pets and drown them some place or put them on the road and watch them get run over! He even came close to choking the life out of his cat in a drunken rage!
Your brother did something that hurt innocent animals and their owners! He needs help! By burying your head in the sand and denying the problem you are only hurting yourself, your mom and your brother! "
I have one cousin who has serious mental problems who threaten the president more than once and his mom had to get a restraining order against him because he would threaten to kill her more than once!
My dad would come home drunk and slap my mom around! He even would threaten to take our pets and drown them some place or put them on the road and watch them get run over! He even came close to choking the life out of his cat in a drunken rage!
Your brother did something that hurt innocent animals and their owners! He needs help! By burying your head in the sand and denying the problem you are only hurting yourself, your mom and your brother! "
naturalblonde196 wrote on Sep 11, 2008 4:29 PM:
" So, how come I looked at the other articles with the lady that put her 2 year old son in the trunk of her car or Duncan or just today the rape of a 15 year old girl and none of you people are commenting? Hm................................ "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 11, 2008 3:05 PM:
" What the family doesn't realize is that some people don't seen any differenct between the three boys and the man in the below article. I for one see each of the boys as equal to Robert Williams in tne Below article.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/06/nyregion/06rape.html "
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/06/nyregion/06rape.html "
finished wrote on Sep 11, 2008 2:12 PM:
" one more thing my brother did it once and i love my brother with all my heart and i hope and pray that if a family member of yours screws up then they through the book at him punish him to the fullest exctent of the law like your hoping on my brother! to those of you who care "
Mt_Native wrote on Sep 11, 2008 8:05 AM:
" Finished: Then enlighten us all and tell us "Y" these young men did what they did! We will be awaiting your response. I am sorry for the family members and close friends. It's nothing any family member should have to go through, but unfortunately, sometimes we have to. Bottom line is that what they did was sick, twisted, demonic, and plain wrong. They are old enough to know better and they chose to do the wrong. All three of these men are sick. There is something wrong with anyone who could do this torture over and over and over again and not even feel some remorse. I am sure you think and feel the same way about serial killers....and you would feel the same way if it weren't a family member. So, your best bet is to NOT read these comments. Again, we await your response on why these men did what they did. "
freetime wrote on Sep 10, 2008 5:17 PM:
" No offense to finished but if you want to make your point you should do it in a nicer way!
No one put a gun to your brother's head and made him go out and help kill and slaughter innocent pets and stray cats! These cats (and owners) did not deserve this!
Your brother seems to have some serious problems that needs to be address and hopefully he gets the help he desperately needs before he turns the hated he had for those poor cats into hated for humans!
I came from a broken abusive family where I was verbally/physically abused and was diagnosed with PTSD!
Your brother is twenty years old so he obviously knows the difference between right and wrong! Instead of making excuses for him you should be pushing for treatment before it is too late for him and society! "
No one put a gun to your brother's head and made him go out and help kill and slaughter innocent pets and stray cats! These cats (and owners) did not deserve this!
Your brother seems to have some serious problems that needs to be address and hopefully he gets the help he desperately needs before he turns the hated he had for those poor cats into hated for humans!
I came from a broken abusive family where I was verbally/physically abused and was diagnosed with PTSD!
Your brother is twenty years old so he obviously knows the difference between right and wrong! Instead of making excuses for him you should be pushing for treatment before it is too late for him and society! "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 5:04 PM:
" I certainly do not condone any of these boys being hurt or tortured and I see no reason for any family members to be personally attacked for something they did but I find it disturbing that the family members seem to believe these acts were not serious. What I am talking about is the facts and evidence. These crimes were willfully committed not once or twice but twenty times. There is no reason for twenty times other than obsession. Which more than likely escalates as time goes on. Luckily they were caught at this point and perhaps can be deterred but not with people making light of their actions or providing excuses for them. They are sick and they need real help. Sorry. But better now than after they end up like Dahmer or the BTK killer, who both tortured animals as well. "
finished wrote on Sep 10, 2008 2:16 PM:
" okay this is messed up. Im not talking about the artical im talking about the fact you chose not to get the damn facts. you visiosly atack people that you do not know you attack there family and i know this because im one of those damn family members i wont reveal my name that would make it worse but you people need to get your facts straight and you know what i was in the cort room i had to watch my brother in jail on a tv screen and im dying inside because people are attacking him saying hes sick well i think your all sick for attacking people you dont know!!!!!!!!! i do not condone what he did but i know what he did and y so shove your rude comments were the sun dont shine!!!!!!!!! think about how i feel my mother feels and my brother and father "
cwelch2006 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 10:22 AM:
" I am done reading these and done replying. I thank all of the readers that are at least trying get the full story before talking about burning and stabbing my son. To everyone else well.....I pray that if someone in your family ever does anything that incurs the types of statements I have read here that you and your loved one have the loving support that Andy and I have from my family and friends. It's easy to judge from your computer and make statements that fire up a community to lynch somebody. So, please know that I will pray for everyone here that wants to hurt my son because no one here knows exactly what happened. "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:52 AM:
" cwelch, your statements regarding your son concern me. You seem to believe that he has merely made some bad choices and got in with the wrong people. I am sorry but what those boys did was clearly predatory behavior. It was not a dislike of the animals that drove them to torture and kill them, I would bet money that at least one of them became sexually aroused during the process. People like that usually have severe insecurity and self-loathing issues. 20 cats is not a mistake, not a bad choice but a willing participation in the de-humanization of ones self and others around them. Once you begin to regard life as something you can snuff out at your whim then no creature including people will be safe around you. Think about what you are going through now and imagine what it would be like had they targeted humans. "
naturalblonde196 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:18 AM:
" Oh my gosh but get over this already! I am sick of hearing about this. get a life already. They will be punish these guys and they will either go to jail or not. Let it go and let's move on to something more important. Something tells me that alot of you same people believe abortion is a choice and not murder of a baby. So, sorry if I just have decided to be done with this and stop giving these boys any more attention. Deal with what we can change. Innocent babies are being tortured and killed every day but the only difference is this is considered LEGAL! I hate this whole cat thing too but please just GET OVER IT ALREADY!!!!!!! "
imelda wrote on Sep 9, 2008 10:38 PM:
" I agree it is disgusting, but stop and think for a moment. If we torture and kill them we'll have become as bad as they are themselves. And I have to wonder why this story is reaping more outrage than the story about the child sexual predator. "
skosena wrote on Sep 9, 2008 9:09 PM:
" 2buck2...good point..I had not thought about it from the point of view that these three men have not been convicted yet....and I hope they are.
Butteborn...well sir...um...I am not really a nutcase...I mean...I don't have a psychiatric disorder...if you mean that I am a nutcase because I have a different idea or something to add to a discussion that does not lean to your way of thinking than ...yep ...I am the nutcase in question. And thank you for asking about me and where I hail from...definantly NOT butte (thank the Lord for small favors)...but I am from montana....and I am a woman...with my own opinion...and I live in the USA...so I get to express it.
Just like you did. "
Butteborn...well sir...um...I am not really a nutcase...I mean...I don't have a psychiatric disorder...if you mean that I am a nutcase because I have a different idea or something to add to a discussion that does not lean to your way of thinking than ...yep ...I am the nutcase in question. And thank you for asking about me and where I hail from...definantly NOT butte (thank the Lord for small favors)...but I am from montana....and I am a woman...with my own opinion...and I live in the USA...so I get to express it.
Just like you did. "
Butteborn wrote on Sep 9, 2008 5:41 PM:
" STOP ALREADY with the BLEEDING HEART DIATRIBE FOR THESE SCUMBAGS. Who gives a rat's patoot what kind of childhood they had? Who cares if they had a traumatic experience during "potty training". I don't care if their parents rival Mother Theresa for sainthood.....
Bottom line.....HANG 'EM HIGH and QUICKLY. I sent this article to a national website called petabuse.com. If you think the Lewis & Clark County Attorney won't hear from those around the USA about this case...HE SHOULD THINK AGAIN!
By the way...where did the nutcase who somehow managed to bring the ABORTION issue into this discussion come from?
them.
Thank God that Montana finally adopted the felony conviction for cases exceeding 10 animals (the law being brought about by the purebed Collie episode in Shelby, brought in across the Canadian border years ago)
I don't shoot much anymore....but used to be a damned good shot. Actually, it would be MORE fun to be a BAD SHOT and just watch 'em suffer...as those cats did. "
Bottom line.....HANG 'EM HIGH and QUICKLY. I sent this article to a national website called petabuse.com. If you think the Lewis & Clark County Attorney won't hear from those around the USA about this case...HE SHOULD THINK AGAIN!
By the way...where did the nutcase who somehow managed to bring the ABORTION issue into this discussion come from?
them.
Thank God that Montana finally adopted the felony conviction for cases exceeding 10 animals (the law being brought about by the purebed Collie episode in Shelby, brought in across the Canadian border years ago)
I don't shoot much anymore....but used to be a damned good shot. Actually, it would be MORE fun to be a BAD SHOT and just watch 'em suffer...as those cats did. "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 9, 2008 5:02 PM:
" That is an interesting point skosena but from my understanding those men convicted of the crimes against children will be punished for it as not only will our laws bring justice to them but a certain code within the prison systems will bring additional justice. A child predator is not something you want to be in prison. I believe the outrage here stems from knowing that these individuals will more than likely receive a slap on the wrist for their crimes even though they are just as dangerous to us if not more than the other two men.
The problem is I will no longer have to be concerned with the two child predators, but these young men will be back on our streets soon and ready to hunt again. "
The problem is I will no longer have to be concerned with the two child predators, but these young men will be back on our streets soon and ready to hunt again. "
ilovemt wrote on Sep 9, 2008 4:39 PM:
" http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/06/nyregion/06rape.html
The above article is about a man that turned to human torture....slighly scary thought. "
The above article is about a man that turned to human torture....slighly scary thought. "
ILOVEMT wrote on Sep 9, 2008 2:49 PM:
" http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/men-torture-kill-cats-in-helena-montana
I suggest to everyone to visit this website and sign the petition to get the men punished to the fullest extent of the law! "
I suggest to everyone to visit this website and sign the petition to get the men punished to the fullest extent of the law! "
capital_city wrote on Sep 9, 2008 2:40 PM:
" Michael Vick received 23 months in prison for helping torture/kill innocent dogs. We know his star status had something to do with the light sentencing.
This crime is no different, except there may be dozens of victims in this case - and there are no super stars. Only a plea bargain, or another terrible decision by our judges, will spare them the maximum punishment. Sign the petition and call the prosecuting attorney.
State AND federal charges should be filed in this case! "
This crime is no different, except there may be dozens of victims in this case - and there are no super stars. Only a plea bargain, or another terrible decision by our judges, will spare them the maximum punishment. Sign the petition and call the prosecuting attorney.
State AND federal charges should be filed in this case! "
cwelch2006 wrote on Sep 9, 2008 2:25 PM:
" Thank you skosena and onvoice for being able to articulate exactly what I wanted to say. "
skosena wrote on Sep 9, 2008 12:51 PM:
" cwelch...I am sorry people feel justified in attacking you and your family. I hope your son can get some help. Your mothers heart must be very burdened and you do not deserve such hate directed at you.
I to am sickened by the abuse of these animals....
however....
I find it interesting that the lives of these cats seem more precious to us than the 1.3 million baby's that were aborted last year....or that an article about a man in our community CONVICTED for child pornography (he even stated the ages he preferred) that was in the paper the same day as this one and an article the next day of the sentencing of a CONVICTED child sexual predictor does not draw the same outrage from our citizens....makes me scratch my head.... "
I to am sickened by the abuse of these animals....
however....
I find it interesting that the lives of these cats seem more precious to us than the 1.3 million baby's that were aborted last year....or that an article about a man in our community CONVICTED for child pornography (he even stated the ages he preferred) that was in the paper the same day as this one and an article the next day of the sentencing of a CONVICTED child sexual predictor does not draw the same outrage from our citizens....makes me scratch my head.... "
onevoice wrote on Sep 9, 2008 11:36 AM:
" As I read the comments posted by so many, I have to wonder what has happened to our society as a whole. Yes, these boys did wrong and the deed should not go unpunished. But how sick are those of you while you sit in your homes hiding the skeletons in your closets. How sick that you think of the punishments such as burned alive, hell welcoming him with open arms, or even stabbing sharp nine inch nails into them. Wow, if you don't have someone in your families that you aren't so proud of then you are the Cleavers! This community has stepped up to help all the kids and adults on the Meth project, what you don't hear is what they do for drugs, or better yet, you don't want to hear it. Are you doing something about it? Are you volunteering to help the cause? Or are you just lowering yourselves to that level by gossiping ans speculating that these kids must have been abused or adopted. Dear I tellithowitis...let me enlighten you a bit, here is how it really is, once a child leaves the home and is on their own, they are resposible for their own actions. That has nothing to do with parenting, it has nothing to do with how they were taught in school, it has nothing to do with being a bully or being bullied. It is choices. Certainly torturing any animal is horrid, I agree, the point I am making is, how about you show a little sympathy toward the mom, she did not take his hand and say her son..do this. And to even say that you hope her son suffers as much as the cats did, well, thats your opinion.I would not wish these things on anyone. I sure hope you have never hurt anyones fellings, or hurt anything in your life for fear that someone may think the same thing of you. I also hope that somewhere you have a bit of decency to offer the mothers of these guys a bit of respect. Are they proud, certainly not, but they did not force them to do this. Was it a sick act? Yes it was. Do they need help? Yes they do, and should be punished for the crime, with the same laws that you would want your family member to have. People in glass houses....you know the rest. "
montanadude wrote on Sep 9, 2008 10:50 AM:
" For those wondering what the punishment will be, the maximum sentance allowed in this case would be a fine not to exceed $50,000 and/or 40 years in the pen. (That is, $2,500 times the known 20 incidents that they knowingly confessed to the police of, plus 2 years per cat is 40 years. See subsection (2c) that allows each cat to be treated as a seperate offense.
Also restitution should be made, if not to the owners, to the PETA or L&C Humane Society.
These three will not be missed in our community when they move to Deer Lodge.
45-8-211. Cruelty to animals
(2) (a) A person convicted of the offense of cruelty to animals shall be fined an amount not to exceed $1,000 or be imprisoned in the county jail for a term not to exceed 1 year, or both. A person convicted of a second or subsequent offense of cruelty to animals or of a first or subsequent offense of aggravated animal cruelty shall be fined an amount not to exceed $2,500 or be sentenced to the department of corrections for a term not to exceed 2 years, or both.
(c) For the purposes of this subsection (2), when more than one animal is subject to cruelty to animals, each act may comprise a separate offense.
(3) In addition to the sentence provided in subsection (2), the court:
(a) shall require the defendant to pay all reasonable costs incurred in providing necessary veterinary attention and treatment for any animal affected, including reasonable costs of care incurred by a public or private animal control agency or humane animal treatment shelter; "
Also restitution should be made, if not to the owners, to the PETA or L&C Humane Society.
These three will not be missed in our community when they move to Deer Lodge.
45-8-211. Cruelty to animals
(2) (a) A person convicted of the offense of cruelty to animals shall be fined an amount not to exceed $1,000 or be imprisoned in the county jail for a term not to exceed 1 year, or both. A person convicted of a second or subsequent offense of cruelty to animals or of a first or subsequent offense of aggravated animal cruelty shall be fined an amount not to exceed $2,500 or be sentenced to the department of corrections for a term not to exceed 2 years, or both.
(c) For the purposes of this subsection (2), when more than one animal is subject to cruelty to animals, each act may comprise a separate offense.
(3) In addition to the sentence provided in subsection (2), the court:
(a) shall require the defendant to pay all reasonable costs incurred in providing necessary veterinary attention and treatment for any animal affected, including reasonable costs of care incurred by a public or private animal control agency or humane animal treatment shelter; "
cwelch2006 wrote on Sep 9, 2008 9:28 AM:
" In response to itellithowitis2. I hope that you never have to experience a loved one making mistakes. Andy fell in with some very bad people and did some very bad things but thankfully it is the Lord that will forgive him because he knows who my son truly is. I feel sorry for anyone that holds such anger and pain in their heart as you do. So many people here have made very intelligent and rational statments about this issue. I have read them all and agreed with many but yours are just frightening. I hope that Andy can get the help he needs in every way but I sincerely hope that you do also. "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 9, 2008 9:10 AM:
" Hi, I signed the petition "Men Torture & Kill Cats in Helena, Montana!!". I'm asking you to sign this petition to help us reach our goal of 1,000 signatures. I care deeply about this cause, and I hope you will support our efforts.
You can view this petition at: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/tell-a-friend/1616914 "
You can view this petition at: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/tell-a-friend/1616914 "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 8, 2008 5:19 PM:
" Andys Mom:
I'm hoping your son suffers as much as all the cats did combined someday. I wish that upon him with all my heart. I pray that what goes around comes around and I'm sure that hell will welcome him with open arms. "
I'm hoping your son suffers as much as all the cats did combined someday. I wish that upon him with all my heart. I pray that what goes around comes around and I'm sure that hell will welcome him with open arms. "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 8, 2008 11:25 AM:
" Andy's mom, yes you should try to help your son. This behavior is what serial killers are made of. Edmund Kemper also killed cats, including dismembering the family cat before he killed his own mother, removed her head and raped the body. The animals he killed were simply practice for her, and the six college girls he murdered. I personally do not wish any harm to these individuals, but I cannot say I feel comfortable with them being in the same community. The only option I see is removal from our society which leaves death or prison. "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 8, 2008 9:49 AM:
" I'm disgusted that people are sticking up and supporting these guys. I'm ashamed to be a human. "
naturalblonde196 wrote on Sep 7, 2008 3:12 PM:
" Okay. Okay. I am an animal lover to the max but some of these comments are making me sick. I have no idea how anyone can do the things these guys did but to hear members of our community talking about burning and stabbing these boys is just as atrocious. Please remember that we are a civilized society and try to deal with this in a like manner. I happen to know one of these boys and his family and I can tell you that this has horrified and shocked them also. And no they aren't a bunch of abusers. They are a God fearing family just like you and I . Bad choices led to more bad choices to horrible choices. Do I think they should get punishment? Yes I do. And definitely some mental health that maybe includes jail time and commital to someplace. I just want us to remember that we are the civilized ones here. "
cwelch2006 wrote on Sep 7, 2008 1:41 PM:
" All you people who are judging him right now please take a minute to remember that he hasn't always been the man that did these horrible things. What he did was so wrong and I can't imagine how he could hurt those animals. I know that he did and a part of me hates him for the pain he has caused so many people but mostly for the pain he is causing himself. All I can do is try to help him..........try to make him see that he is lost and needs to take the punishment that is going to come to him because maybe this will be a wake up call that he is going down a path that will only lead him to prison or death. "
cwelch2006 wrote on Sep 7, 2008 9:35 AM:
" I am Andy's mom. I am ashamed about my son right now but all you people who are judging him right now please take a minute to remember that he hasn't always been the man that did these horrible things. What he did was so wrong and I can't imagine how he could hurt those animals. I know that he did and a part of me hates him for the pain he has caused so many people but mostly for the pain he is causing himself. All I can do is try to help him..........try to make him see that he is lost and needs to take the punishment that is going to come to him because maybe this will be a wake up call that he is going down a path that will only lead him to prison or death. "
itellithowitis2 wrote on Sep 6, 2008 6:59 PM:
" Getting the serious attention of law enforcement, prosecutors and the community in cases involving allegations of cruelty to animals is an essential step in protecting the community. The connection between animal cruelty and human violence is well documented. Studies show a correlation between animal cruelty and all manner of other crimes, from narcotics and firearms violations to battery and sexual assault.
Those who abuse animals can be dangerous to people, said Desiree Bender, The HSUSs Arkansas state director. Americans have no tolerance for violence against the creatures who share our world. "
Those who abuse animals can be dangerous to people, said Desiree Bender, The HSUSs Arkansas state director. Americans have no tolerance for violence against the creatures who share our world. "
LegAdv wrote on Sep 6, 2008 2:28 PM:
" Notwithstanding the fact that the three individuals charged with these crimes are legally presumed innocent at this point, the conduct described in this article is outrageous and could be best described as the product of a diabolical mind on steroids. As a cat owner, my deepest sympathies go out to those who have lost their pets as a result of these horrific incidents. I don't know whether Montana statutory law imposes sentencing guidelines, but if it does, I believe the 'high end' of those guidelines would seem to be appropriate for anyone convicted of a crime involving this type of behavior. "
mtblueslover wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:57 AM:
" It doesn't matter what species. It's a crime against life. Imagine the agony, the misunderstanding of what is happening by that being, the stupor at the end. These three people collaborated to inflict every bit of horrible ugly pain they could upon a trusting little life; one who's trying to exist just like the rest of us. Being that it's "a cat" has nothing to do with it. Their willful intentions have everything to do with it. They need to face consequences that will get them to think about how they behave within the circle of life. If they can't be rehabilitated, regardless of philosophic belief, it is a natural law of physics that goes around... does come around. They will get what they deserve sooner or later, and I hope they do. "
ginger wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:58 AM:
" Lewis and Clark County Attorney/Public Administrator
Courthouse 228 Broadway
Helena, MT 59601
Phone: (406) 447-8221
Facsimile: (406) 447-8268
E-mail: countyattorney(at)co.lewis-clark.mt.us "
Courthouse 228 Broadway
Helena, MT 59601
Phone: (406) 447-8221
Facsimile: (406) 447-8268
E-mail: countyattorney(at)co.lewis-clark.mt.us "
ginger wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:57 AM:
" please everyone use this momentum to write a rational letter to the county attorney requesting that these people receive the maximum punishment allowed by the law. The prosecuters and judge need to know how the community feels about this behavior. "
firecracker wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:01 PM:
" "dakota_rt." All people say how these guys should be tortured, yet one person, littlemuchkin says "Thou Shalt Not Kil" and feels that they would like to be in line to do the same thing to these boys and they are psycho and irrational? The law will take care of them...here but NO ONE is abnormal for feeling they do, some just express their feelings in a different way!!! "
Michelle79 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:06 PM:
" Ive read everyone's comments and I agree with everything that's been said. These guys are sick and twisted, They Will turn from hurting animals to hurting Humans. in a big sense they really already have hurt this community with their actions. By stealing and killing peoples pets. most people view their pets as a family member as already mentioned. so yes they have hurt people already. I'm hoping and praying that our justice system will show these men They cannot and will not get away with just a slap on the wrist. really that will only fuel them on thinking they have gotten away with what they have done. and keep hurting animals and people. I can't even wrap my mind around this whole situation. its beyond words just horribly sick and demented. I have been active in this community by taking care of and feeding stray cats, I have many cats myself. as well as a dog. I love animals. I hope this does NOT go unpunished with more then community service and fines. "
kensmail2001 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:20 PM:
" "it was just a bad decision/mistake"?
Don't bet on it.....I have had run ins with one of these individuals...mark my words...someone will have trouble with him again... "
Don't bet on it.....I have had run ins with one of these individuals...mark my words...someone will have trouble with him again... "
mt-native wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:59 PM:
" Their parents must be so proud! Were they bullies in school too? I say "an eye for an eye" "
capital_city wrote on Sep 5, 2008 4:32 PM:
" Sad to say, these alleged felons will get no more than probation and a slap on the wrist. The felonies will be reduced to a misdermeanor and this story will fade out of the IR faster than the felons who shot the herd of antelope and plead not guilty. What ever happened to them, anyway?
Anyway, let's just wait for some lame comments about how "nice and innocent" these 'boys' are and how "we don't know them" or "it was just a bad decision/mistake". Typically, this is where I'd say let the criminal justice system go to work, but unfortunately it will put these geniuses back on the street in no time at all. Same old, same old... "
Anyway, let's just wait for some lame comments about how "nice and innocent" these 'boys' are and how "we don't know them" or "it was just a bad decision/mistake". Typically, this is where I'd say let the criminal justice system go to work, but unfortunately it will put these geniuses back on the street in no time at all. Same old, same old... "
2buck2 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 4:16 PM:
" If they hadn't been caught it would have only been a matter of time before these three were stalking high school and college girls and luring them into their car to take them out to remote places and commit similar acts to them. Most often this type of behavior is practice for humans. There are animals that I dislike, but I don't go out an become a sociopath because of it. "
rlabelin wrote on Sep 5, 2008 3:14 PM:
" I feel that everyone who thinks it was wrong should be given a sharp Nine inch Nail to insert randomly into the perpetraitors via 28 ounce framing hammer. "
Bigskygirl wrote on Sep 5, 2008 2:40 PM:
" I could not believe what I was reading. I too hope they get the punishment they deserve and have coming to them. I live in Helena and am missing two cats. I had contacted the Human Society and everything I could think of, I have been just sick over this! These are like my children and can not believe that there are people amoung us that are this meantally ill! What would be next, our children? "
dakota_rt wrote on Sep 5, 2008 2:20 PM:
" "littlemunchkin"
Really? Your ranting is really not just....thou shalt not kill?! But you want to be the first in line to torture these boys with a hunting knife and a bow. What makes you better? In fact, these boys are headed down the same road as some of the most notorious serial killers of our time, yes, punishment is necessary and they should be punished to the full extent of the law. But, you lining up to stab them with your hunting knife is not even something normal. That's psycho, and irrational on your part... "
Really? Your ranting is really not just....thou shalt not kill?! But you want to be the first in line to torture these boys with a hunting knife and a bow. What makes you better? In fact, these boys are headed down the same road as some of the most notorious serial killers of our time, yes, punishment is necessary and they should be punished to the full extent of the law. But, you lining up to stab them with your hunting knife is not even something normal. That's psycho, and irrational on your part... "
mark1228 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 1:55 PM:
" I am no cat lover (no offense to those that are) but there is just no excuse for this kind of behavior. What I find interesting is that they did not like cats, but the killing spree started when one of them PICKED UP A CAT and it scratched him. Can't blame that cat. "
FISHING wrote on Sep 5, 2008 12:16 PM:
" GO BACK WHERE YOU CAME FROM!!!!!!! YOU DON'T BELONG IN ANY OF OUR COMMUNITIES!!! "
independantwoman wrote on Sep 5, 2008 12:06 PM:
" Sick! Throw the book at them! What a shame to humanity these boys are! "
littlemunchkin wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:47 AM:
" Maybe in my last comment, "justice" was NOT the right word... "PUNISHMENT" is more like it. What about "Thou Shalt Not Kill?" However, revenge is sweet. I am sure there are many that would like to give the 3 hoodlums a taste of their own medicine. I hear tasars work well, also since hunting season is upon us, knives and bows can be appropriate as well. I will be first in line to help out with this!!! These people are wrong. They are sick, sick, sick and do not deserve to see the light of day again. No one can replace a lost, beloved pet but some type of compensation should be made to those who lost their beloved cat. My prayers are with those who have lost a special friend. My heart is breaking "
dakota_rt wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:42 AM:
" Statistically, the average serial killer is a white male from a lower to middle class background, usually in his twenties or thirties. Many were physically or emotionally abused by parents. Some were adopted. As children, fledgling serial killers often set fires, TORTURED ANIMALS, and wet their beds (these red-flag behaviors are known as the "triad" of symptoms.)
Let's hope these individuals are taken care of before they become the next Gacy, Dahmer, Berkowitz or Gein! "
Let's hope these individuals are taken care of before they become the next Gacy, Dahmer, Berkowitz or Gein! "
racer wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:38 AM:
" Let the punishment for these scumbags me carried out by fellow felines - put them in a cage full of mountain lions and tigers. It makes one wonder what else these individuals are capable of - they could turn on other humans next. "
BabiC wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:36 AM:
" Boy these sound like big, strong men. I'm willing to be they're all single. Surprise. Throw the book at them. They are getting off too easy - compared to the cats. That's horrible. What a waste to society. "
littlemunchkin wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:20 AM:
" What a disgrace. How can any human being do this to an innocent creature that cannot defend themselves? These cats did not deserve this!!! These are Gods innocent creatures. I own 2 cats of my own and if these were my cats I would be devestated. I hope that swift justice is dealt to these three hoodlums. "
Redbirdie wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:20 AM:
" These three jerks should be burned alive or otherwise treated the way they treated peoples' pets. "
clancycoot wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:17 AM:
" those poor guys, they must have had horrible childhoods "
MrKenaiB wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:07 AM:
" People who treat animals in such a manner generally abuse their own children,wives or families is some way, eventually. These men never learned right from wrong and are obviously full of hatred - not just for the animals they killed but for life. The same goes for the man who shot his horse then dragged it behind his trailer and for the Georgia men who packed their horses in the Bitteroot until the horses were starved and had sores to the bone. It's a sad statement on our society. "
montanadude wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:01 AM:
" I seriously hope these guys go to prison for these very henious and outrageous crimes against the community. There is something outrageously wrong with having scum like this in our city.
Refreshing to see that for once, both left and right, the entire forum is in complete agreement on this one. "
Refreshing to see that for once, both left and right, the entire forum is in complete agreement on this one. "
secret77 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:50 AM:
" So sad, think of the elderly and children (& anyone else) missing their pets and now knowing what has possibly happened to them.
These guys won't stop here. This is where is begins, torturing vulnerable animals!! "
These guys won't stop here. This is where is begins, torturing vulnerable animals!! "
blackdog wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:50 AM:
" WOW How Cruel!! There is something wrong with people who can do things like this. I hope they are prosecuted and actually do jail time, Not just Probation reguardless if it is there first offence. These guys should be considered Violent offenders and have to register. I hope they are proud of themselves torturing helpless animals maybe Deer Lodge will teach them what is like to be helpless, someone needs too. "
greenanvil wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:40 AM:
" My questions have finally been answered. I live in the North Valley and have horse property and a barn. I have lost 3 mousers in the last 10 weeks, and had attributed it to a hawk or coyote. I hope these men are punished to the full extent of the law. As rc83 said, who knows what they would do next. It's fact that those who murder people, especially serial killers, have a history of killing and torturing animals. I believe we should have a show of force in the courtroom when these men face trial. The pet lovers and animal advocates should be present in the courtoom so the judge would know how this has affected the community. Not a violent action, just a show of numbers. "
thedukeofhelena wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:14 AM:
" I am in tears right now and completely enraged. This makes me so sick and it is so wrong. Please make sure these killers are punished for this. At the point I am at now, I would gladly do the same to them what they did to my favorite animals. My sympathies to all who lost their best friends. "
ahanns wrote on Sep 5, 2008 9:00 AM:
" what a bunch of sickos!! Can't these men find anything better to do with their time than killing other peoples pets? They should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. "
enu22 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:38 AM:
" These people are sadistic, sick, cold-hearted, perverts with psychopathic mindsets. I hope our "justice" system culls them from our society by sending them to the Deerlodge big house. "
rc83 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:24 AM:
" I cannot believe someone would have the heart to do something like this! How sick, they should be punished to the maximum. And since they've done these horrible acts, just imagine what they may do later down the road possibly to other human beings. They've got the taste of blood now, and who knows when or if they'll ever stop. How sad. "
ar23 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:22 AM:
" Disgusting. Maybe we can arrange for these guys to try this on a few of my friends and I. That would be great. "
Crabby1 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:11 AM:
" This is just sickening! Just because these scourages of society don't like cats doesn't mean they can kill them. If you don't like cats, stay away from them! Jerks! Some of these cats were pets; members of people's families. How would the community view this if these cats were human? "
purple wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:42 AM:
" I have the puuuurfect punishment for these scumbags - treat them the exact same way they treated those cats.
Video tape their treatment and provide the tape so it can be run on YOUTUBE for the whole world to see. "
Video tape their treatment and provide the tape so it can be run on YOUTUBE for the whole world to see. "
freetime wrote on Sep 5, 2008 6:34 AM:
" I say let the punishment fit the crime or throw them out in the streets and let the cat lovers in the area take "care" of them!
I wonder what these three sickos would have done if they suddenly had a instant hated of humans esp. people who could not fight back! "
I wonder what these three sickos would have done if they suddenly had a instant hated of humans esp. people who could not fight back! "
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